Canada’s Queen of Rock Sass Jordan

Sing! Dance! Act! Thrive! Podcast Episode 013

I have such a good fun show for you today with the fabulous Sass Jordan. This episode is really what I hoped all episodes would be like, a fun and casual conversation about life in the arts.  It helped that I have known and worked with Sass for many years so I was comfortable.  With others, I’m still learning how to build that rapport so it becomes a conversation and less of a question and answer interview.

Anyways for those who do not know Sass Jordan, she is Canada’s Queen of Rock.  In her 30 years in the spotlight, she has gotten to work with many of her influences including Aerosmith, The Rolling Stones, AC/DC, Cheap Trick, Santana, Joe Cocker, Styx, Rodger Hodgson, and countless others. She has won various awards, including Juno and Billboard, and has sold over a million records worldwide.

She also had a short-lived acting career playing Janis Joplin in the off-Broadway hit, “Love Janis and as a featured character in the television series Sisters.  She tells a hilarious story of how she auditioned for a role on a Die Hard movie and shocked everyone on the set by walking out because she didn’t want to die on screen.  And she was one of the judges on Canadian Idol.


Sing! Dance! Act! Thrive! Podcast Episode 013

Welcome to Sing Dance Act Thrive, featuring conversations with performing artists and industry influencers on what it takes to succeed in the arts. I am your host Diane Foy and I believe that you really can make a living from your creative talents. As a publicist, podcaster and coach. My mission is to educate, motivate and empower you to thrive with authenticity, creativity and purpose.

Diane Foy  0:40

Hello and welcome to episode number 13 of Sing Dance Act Thrive. I have such a fun show for you today with the fabulous Sass Jordan. This episode is really what I hoped all episodes would be like. A fun and casual conversation about life and the art. It helped that I’ve known and worked with Sass for many years, so I was comfortable. With others I’m still learning, learning how to build a rapport so it becomes a conversation and less of a question and answer interview. I’ll get there.

Anyways, for those of you who do not know Sass Jordan, she is Canada’s Queen of Rock. In her 30 years in the spotlight, she has gotten to work with many of her influences, including Aerosmith, The Rolling Stones, AC/DC, Cheap Trick, Santana, Joe Cocker, Styx and countless others. She’s won various awards, including Juno and Billboard, and has sold over a million records worldwide. She also had a short-lived acting career, playing Janis Joplin in the off-Broadway hit, Love Janice. And as a featured character in the TV series Sisters. She tells a hilarious story of how she auditioned for a role on a Die Hard movie, and shocked everyone on the set by walking out because she didn’t want to die on screen. And she was one of the judges on Canadian Idol. We laughed a lot. And I’m sure you’re going to be laughing a lot too shaking your head sometimes because this is hilarious. Anyways, I hope you enjoy it.

Diane Foy  2:20                                  Welcome to the show.

Sass Jordan  2:21                    Thanks.

Diane Foy  2:24                                  So I have a podcast now.

Sass Jordan  2:25                    I see that.

Diane Foy  2:27                                  I’m still doing publicity. But then I’ve also gotten into coaching artists.

Sass Jordan  2:31                    Coaching them to do what?

Diane Foy  2:33                                  Marketing and creativity, personal branding.

Sass Jordan 2:38

Oh, that’s great. That’s great. Because a lot of people, you know, they’re just about the music. And they have no idea. Because now it’s really up to the artists, isn’t it? It’s not, it’s not like it’s being taken care of for you by like, you know, a big machine anymore you have to be the machine.

Diane Foy  2:53

Part of the podcast is to interview thriving successful artists on how you got there and any advice that you might have for new artists

Sass Jordan  3:04

You know, I don’t know how relevant well, we’ll find out. as I say, how relevant my experiences to anybody who’s starting or new now, because I didn’t go through what they’re going through, you know what I mean? Like, I have no idea.

Diane Foy 3:21                                               Completely different.

Sass Jordan 3:23

Exactly. I’m really I just I can’t all tell you if, if I was starting today, I just wouldn’t do it. I wouldn’t you know, I don’t I don’t care. I’m not I’m just not that, you know, I love music. I love singing. I love performing. But I all the other stuff, I just forget it. I think I go into like, you know, self help.

Diane Foy  3:49                                  You’re one of those artists

Sass Jordan 3:50                                 Exact attack and luckily, baby.

Diane Foy  3:56

And back then you could I guess because you had other people to kind of take care of well another show.

Sass Jordan  4:00

Well in the end. Nobody can take care of it except you. That’s the truth. But no one was telling me how to talk or how to be, as you can see from a lot of those stupid ass interviews I get thousands of years ago. Maybe if someone had, that would have been a good thing. But I wouldn’t have listened to them anyway. So there’s that.

Diane Foy 4:20

But you’re lucky in the sense that you’ve, you’ve been doing this for so long that you’re kind of established at a certain level. And you can do your thing.

Sass Jordan  4:31                    First of all, it’s not luck.

Diane Foy          4:32              No. That’s a lot of hard work.

Sass Jordan  4:33


It was a lot of hard work. I think you always in this type of thing as in anything which is, which is, you know, dependent on being popular or being, you know, current or what have you. Like, let’s say I was selling a shampoo, I could get that shampoo really great and happening and like the biggest thing in the world for a couple of years. And eventually, I’m either going to have to reinvent it. Right? Or it’s just going to drop off. Because nobody, nothing stays new and exciting and fun. Nothing. Cars, doesn’t matter what it is whatever you’re selling. What in any way, shape or form.

Diane Foy  5:19

Yeah, yeah. Like I think especially with art, everyone has such a short attention span now.

Sass Jordan  5:25


Oh my God, I wouldn’t say its just art, I’d say it’s everything. So you just have to really believe in what you’re doing. Feel that you really have it like, in my case, and with what I do, I have to feel that I really have something to say. And when I say say, I don’t necessarily mean with my voice. For say, I can also I also mean like, you know, with my energy or my vibe, or my whatever, I have something, I have to feel like I have something to say otherwise I have zero motivation to get out there and do it.

Diane Foy  6:02

So what are you working on? Now? Like what’s happening?

Sass Jordan  6:04

Right now, I’m in the middle of putting together this quote unquote, “Blues Record” I say, quote, unquote, because you know, that’s such a vast genre that it’s like, what does that mean? It’s like saying rock. Like I say you know, what does that mean? But I’m doing that, which is really kind of, because I resisted it for a long time to people would say to me, why don’t you make a blues record? And I was like, what a you know, just put me out to pasture why don’t you and then I had like conversations with some people. And we just, it just suddenly seemed like, that could be a lot of fun. And so that’s what I’m working on.

Diane Foy  6:50                      Originals or covers?

Sass Jordan  6:51

Mostly covers, because there’s some stuff that is so insanely cool. And you don’t realize how much of what you do comes from that, you know what I mean? Once you start digging into it, you’re like, holy crap, this is the genesis of it. This was the genesis of this stuff that I do here and that I do there. And, you know, like, it’s just, it’s fascinating to me. So I’m excited about that.

Diane Foy  7:18                      It inspired your music without even knowing it.

Sass Jordan  7:20

Precisely. Exactly Diane. And also to other, you know, to the people that I was directly inspired by they will listen to these people, you know, I mean, everybody eventually gets there. I think, you know, if they’re music fans, they will.

Diane Foy  7:37                      Yeah and what songs are you recording?

Sass Jordan 7:41

I ain’t tellin’ yet, just because it’s not finally for sure. And I don’t want to go either. Because with me, I run my mouth off constantly and said I’m doing this, I’m doing that before I’m actually bloody doing it. And then stuff changes. And it’s you know, it’s an SU not that anyone ever bloody listens to what you say. Anyway.

Diane Foy  8:06

So I can’t come back to you a year from now and go, why didn’t you do that song? You said you’re going to be like…

Sass Jordan  8:14

Exactly. Because people do, they do say stuff like that. Like, what? What are you talking about? I don’t remember that. Because it was a passing thing, a fleeting thing.

Diane Foy  8:22                                  So that’s something that maybe comes out like a year or so?

Sass Jordan  8:26                                No, I wanted it to come out in September.

Diane Foy  8:28                                  So you’re workin’ it out now.

Sass Jordan  8:30

That’s my plan. Yeah, exactly. Exactly. I want to record it in June. That’s our plan. Hopefully, it’ll all come to fruition. It will. I’m just going to, I’ll make it happen. I’m good at that. Yeah. And that’s, that’s, that’s what we’re going to do, baby. And then, you know, I got a bunch of shows and stuff. I have to go to the Netherlands in May, which I love. I love doing that five shows in the Netherlands. And, like it’s, it’s pretty intensive. There’s also a lot of other things that I do that aren’t necessarily related, particularly directly to music, you know, like my wine and like my skin cream and there’s, you know, I’m working on my my other thing that I don’t want to talk about. I’m a lot of fun today aren’t I?

Diane Foy  9:19                                  Okay, I heard about the wine, but skincare too?

Sass Jordan  9:23

It’s not skincare. It’s a it’s a cream that I concocted with someone who makes skin creams. And so she made this line for me. This particular it’s called Sasskin cream. And right now, the only place you can get it it’s very very grassroots kind of thing. You know, the only place you can get it right now is at H2o Float Spa on the Danforth in Toronto. But I plan on getting it to people more people.

Diane Foy  9:55                      That’s cool.

Sass Jordan  9:56                    I love it.

Diane Foy  9:57

What was the inspiration there? What made you want to do that? Like I need a skin cream that does this.


Sass Jordan  10:03

Yes, exactly. I need one that I love. And I don’t know where to get that. And it just sort of metamorphosis from that. That’s how usually things just dropped into my mind when I wake up in the morning. Yes, before I start the day I just lying in bed just before I get up. Usually that’s when I get my most fascinating to me ideas. And none of the oh, you can’t do that part. Come what right when you wake up. Because it’s the oh, you can’t do that part that destroys you every time. Once you get into your bait into your regular everyday thoughts, stuff and routine and this and that. And you know, that’s when you start thinking of all the reasons you can’t do something. And that is a big fat mistake. A big mistake.

Diane Foy  10:50

Yeah, it’s actually I even read a study about it recently, where you are the most creative in the morning. It’s just your stream of consciousness when you first wake up that you really all the creativity. If you’re working on creativity, do that first thing in the morning, and then do like you know the stuff you don’t want later on. Yeah,

Sass Jordan:                            Mundane boring stuff yeah.

Diane Foy:                              But the creativity is at its highest.

Sass Jordan   11:15

I find that except for if like I’m writing songs and stuff that it can be anytime of day. Yeah, but because then I like put that aside and that’s different to me. Because when you’re writing a song, usually like in my case, my everybody else I’ve ever read says the same thing. I of course, I thought it was original. You’re never original baby. Nobody is. But anyways, I when I’m writing a song I usually it’s almost like a downloads to me. I don’t know how to explain that other than it’s like, you know, the music is. It’s like the whisper in your ear and it sort of just, it just takes shape. You know.

Diane Foy:                                          Just flows?

Sass Jordan  11:55                              Yeah, it’s it’s the wildest. I love it.

Diane Foy  11:58                                Do you write every day? Are you one of those kind of songwriters?

Sass Jorda  12:01                                God no, I rarely write. I only write.

Diane For  12:07                                 I was just talking to Mark Jordan.

Sass Jordan  12:11

Are you serious? That was just so weird. We were just talking about him yesterday, because we have the same accountant and I met him at the accountant’s office. Oh, how weird is that? Okay.

Diane Foy  12:22                                Yeah, 2 Jordans today.

Sass Jordan  12:23                              So you were just talking to him, yeah?

Diane Foy  12:26

All about songwriting and how like, he does it every single day, the songwriting process and where he gets ideas from and how he paints as well. And, really interesting.

Sass Jordan  12:38

That’s really cool. That’s so different for me. I have no particular process. I just when there’s a song to be written, I go, right. There’s a song to be written, what’s the title and I think of a title and then I go, but I always write with other people as well. Because I don’t play an instrument. So I’ll always be writing with like, at least one of the person. Actually, almost always only with one other person because I think it gets confusing when there’s more than that. Two is enough for me.

Diane Foy  13:06                                So it always starts with the song title.

Sass Jordan  13:11

No. For the lyric, Yes. Yes, sorry. I’m trying to think of the last. But pretty much usually All right, sorry. That’s the geese.

Diane Foy  13:18                                I’m going, what on earth?

Sass Jordan  13:22

It’s not my stomach. It’s the geese. Oh, yeah, I was standing outside and the buggers is they’re right at my backyard. And they’re shrieking at each other. They’re writing a song actually, they’re writing a song as we speak.

Diane Foy  13:42                                Hey, Sass is recording let’s get in…

Sass Jordan  13:43                              Little buggers. Sorry, I’ll go inside.

Diane Foy  13:45                                No, I like the geese. It’s all good.

Diane Foy  13:50                                So your songwriting process.

Sass Jordan  13:52

Yeah. Which is not a process, so to speak, sometimes a lyrical come to me, you know, get the title from that. But most of the time, I like to have a title I like I like to go, Okay, I’m gonna write a song about this. This is what I want to write about right now. Whatever is inspiring me at that moment. You know, and, and most of the time, Diane, it’ll be the music. The music will inspire the lyric to me, you know, like the chord progression. Music to me always tells a story. You know, that’s what it does. And so then I’ll just book the story type of thing from the music. I’d say that’s my process, to be honest with you. That’s definitely, I guess it is.


Diane Foy  14:35

For some people hear music first, and then they write those lyrics to that, and some do it the other way around.

Sass Jordan  14:44

A lot of people do when they hear music first, but not me.

Diane Foy       14:47

So, wine. That’s very exciting. How on earth did that happen? I want my own wine. I want a wine sponsor.

Sass Jordan  14:55

It’s been such an incredibly fun journey. It happened. But the way it started with me was way back when I was doing the TV show, Canadian Idol, while the production would serve wine in the green room, right? To all the people that you know, all the guests and the VIPs and all that stuff. And one day at the hotel that I was staying at, I was in the restaurant before it opened. And the sommelier, Mark said to me, hey, Sass you should stick around for a minute because I got one of the winemakers from Niagara is coming in. And he can tell you all about wine, if you’re interested in that. And this is like years ago, right? And I’m like, that sounds fascinating. And that’s how I met the extraordinary and incredible Brian Schmidt from Vineland Estates. And we hung out for about a half hour or so. And he was showing me his wine stuff, you know, etc. And I went back to the producers of Canadian Idol and said, listen, we’re at Canadian production. Why don’t we have a Canadian wine in the green room? And they were like, sure, that’s a great idea. And so we started serving Vineland Estates Wines. And that was how I forged the friendship with Brian. And all these years later, one day, last year, I woke up in the morning and went I need a wine, I want to make a wine, how to make a wine. I don’t know how to make a wine. And so I talked to my manager about it. And I said, listen, let’s make a wine and goes, I don’t know how to do that, either. That’s not that’s not my department. I’ve never done anything like that. I’m a music guy. And I’m like, Okay, well, I know what to do. Why don’t we get a meeting with my friend Brian in Niagara. And maybe he can point us in the right direction? So that’s what happened. We went down, we met with Brian, we’re having lunch. You know, shooting the breeze, talking having a blast. You know, he’s showing us wines. We’re drinking wine, yada, yada, yada. And finally, I remember the reason that we’re there is to talk to him about who I would, how would I go about making wine? And I said, Brian, listen, Brian, you know, how can I make a wine, this is why I’m here. I forgot to ask you that. He goes, I don’t worry about that. We’re making you wine. And then he continues to talk about something else. Meanwhile, me and my manager Peter are looking at each other going did he just, he just say that? It’s this, it’s this Earth? Unbelievable. I was so not expecting I thought it was going to be a long, hard road, you know, where I had to go meet these people and how to meet with those people. And he just goes we’re making you wine don’t worry about that. What? And that, my dear, that’s exactly what happened. And now I have a white and a red, 2 vinelands in the States called Kick Ass Sass. And it’s almost sold, first ones almost sold out. So we’re heading into the second mountain. And instead of making 200 cases, this time, we’re making 500 cases. So it’s like, anyways, I yeah, it’s a blast, I have had so much fun doing that, I have to say, it’s just so interesting. Wow, what a different kind of world, they just don’t do things the same way as we do, like, for example, in, in our business, in the music world, you put out a single or a record. And if it doesn’t do anything, in the first two weeks, you can pretty much kiss it goodbye. You know what I mean? Like, in general, it’s like all that work and all that money. And it’s just next to nothing. And in the wine world, I’ve discovered, I was treating it the same way. I was thinking, Okay, actually, to you, you know, the usual kind of thing. And talking Brian’s like, What are you talking about? No, no, no, that’s no, you just build slowly word of mouth, you don’t worry about it, don’t worry about it. And I’m like, oh, my goodness, what a fantastically, it’s like a gift, you know, to experience something like that, after having been in this business for so long. You know.

Diane Foy  19:29

Well I guess, it’s also years ago, there was a lot more artist development, and you didn’t have to have that kickoff hit in the first week, they actually, you know, gave you some time, and you would find a couple albums deal.

Sass Jordan                 Yes, exactly.

Diane Foy                               Instead of you got one single if it’s not a hit in a week, okay.

Sass Jordan  19:48

And in those days, like, Oh, you know, the 90’s, in which you know I was most active in the music business was, you know, you put out a single and then it would go to the local promo reps, and they try to get it on their local stations, and the more ads you got, and it would go over, you know, like, a month, two months, it was like some, it was much a much slower process. And also, there was only that outlet really, I mean, there was no YouTube, there was no, you know, internet, period, really, I mean, 90’s, we didn’t even have barely had cell phones. In fact, we didn’t until the late 90’s, you know what I mean and then they were those big brick block things. And, anyway, so it, it, it was just a whole different landscape. I mean, you know, that was the only way to do it was through radio. These days, there’s many more ways to do it. But because it’s so much more diverse and so scattered, it’s hard to get any kind of momentum now. You know, still or it’s more challenging to get into kind of momentum. Yeah.

Diane Foy  21:02                                And with the wine. So is it only available online?

Sass Jordan  21:07                              Yeah it is, Yeah.

Diane Foy  21:08

Okay. So then it’ll take time before, you know, you’ll be able to get it at the LCDO?  Is that kind of in the work?

Sass Jordan  21:14

It’s not really because the LCDO is a whole different. That’s, trying to think of a nice, politically correct way of saying this, it’s just, that’s a whole other business. It’s yeah, so I, it’s kind of like… It’s like, it started a little bit like a little skin cream, let’s say, and you were just doing it grassroots and all of a sudden, this big, like L’Oreal, let’s say comes along and goes, we love what you’re doing, we’re gonna buy it from you. Right? Then they take that little skin cream, you’re no longer part of it, but they take it into their whole system and their whole massive machine, and they’ll tweak it, and they’ll do this and will do that, you know, it’s no longer yours, it’s out of your hands kind of thing. And with the LCDO, you have to produce a certain amount of cases, in order for them to carry it at all. And then Niagara VQA, Ontario, it’s like, it’s a thing. It’s a thing. So yeah, it’s a whole other thing. And so you know, it has its advantages in that it makes it more available easier, but it makes it more difficult for for you the producer type of thing.

Diane Foy  22:42                                So you got a blues album coming out you got a wine got a skin cream.

Sass Jordan  22:52                              I know. I’m a little bit of a jack of all trades, don’t say massive man.

Diane Foy 22:56                                 No, no. Recently I’ve discovered that I’m a multi-potentialite.

Sass Jordan  22:59                              I love it.

Diane Foy  23:00

Where it used to be called, you know, jack of all trades master of none. But to us like, but I’m really good at the things I do. Come on.

Sass Jordan  23:14                              Exactly.

Diane Foy  23:17                                It’s just that I have a lot of passions.

Sass Jordan                                         Me too.

Diane Foy

And I, you know, you get a new idea. You’re like, Oh my god, I want to do this and then all your effort into that.

Sass Jordan  23:25

Exactly and there’s nothing wrong with that. There’s nothing wrong with that. I mean, in this day and age, it’s it’s rare for people to stay in one job their whole life, you know?

Diane Foy  23:38

Yeah, yeah. You know, I admire people that did though, because then you start to think there’s something wrong with me?

Sass Jordan  23:46

No, there’s nothing wrong with you.

Diane Foy  23:48

Someone that’s always wanted to be a singer and that’s all they’ve done their whole life like, or I used to be a makeup artist. So makeup artist, people, that that’s what they want to do their whole life and they stuck with it. And they  you know, I feel I might be a failure or something I keep changing careers.

Sass Jordan                              No. No.

Diane Foy                                           But now I know, it’s the way to be.

Sass Jordan  24:08

If that’s, what if that’s what you want to do. I think in the in the end, it’s more about what excites you what you have fun doing. Really, why the hell are we on the surface, you know, you got to think about that, too. You’re not here just to make money. Unless that’s what you want. You know what I’m saying you’re here to enjoy yourself, and have fun and to inspire and, and to serve, you know, these are all massively important to me. And all the things that I do have a connection to one of those things that I just said, you know, it’s inspiring, or it’s fun, or it makes money or it’s, it’s, you know, it’s serving, or it’s helping somebody else. Because you know, in the end, helping somebody else makes you feel good. You know that and that is the key, you have to feel good. If you’re going to help anyone else to feel good, you have to feel good in the first place. It’s called authentic.

Diane Foy  25:11

Exactly. I figured out my purpose, my why is like everything I’ve ever done, even though I’ve changed a lot. It’s like it’s always been because I want to be around you crazy people. I want to be around performers. And I started as a photographer, and I want to take pictures of of performers and models and actors. And then makeup artist, same thing. I was always doing videos and stuff. And then so everything I’ve done has always been around performers. And then so coaching is I take all my experience, everything I’ve ever done, and I now I can coach artists through it and kind of help them navigate that.

Sass Jordan  25:54

You see that’s so brilliant because you wouldn’t be able to do that. If you didn’t have all that other experience, you know, because it takes all those things that you just said, and more to make a performer something, you know, worth its all, it really does. Note, there’s no performer that can do it by themselves that doesn’t need all those things. You know, so it’s fantastic that you did all that stuff. I think it was the same with me when I was starting out all the things that I was interested in and got into blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. All really helped me to be a performer that I became, you know, yeah. And the artist.

Diane Foy  26:40

Yeah, it all it all melds together all your influences all your different interests, and directions that you go in it all kind of meld together.

Sass Jordan  26:50

Exactly. And so I always say never ever are wasting your time doing something, it doesn’t matter what it is like, it really doesn’t, because it could be teaching. It could be teaching patients, it could be teaching you,you know, where to put the voice in your throat or in your head or in your body. When you’re singing, it could be teaching you how to sell it, it could be all these things. You know, I worked at McDonald’s for two weeks in my life when I was 14. Two weeks, baby I couldn’t, I couldn’t hack it. I was like dying. And there was a week in between that I didn’t, I worked it for a week took a week off and not for whatever reason I can’t rewrite it and take it off. And they didn’t need me for me. And then I went back and did another week. And then I was like, thank you so much you can keep the gold watch. I’m out. But it taught me, you know, working with the public directly you know.

Diane Foy  27:52                                            What other jobs you had before the big music career?

Sass Jordan  27:57

Oh, gosh, Lord Almighty, let me think about that one because I don’t remember, I think I Oh, I was I tried to be a waitress at that huge club in Montreal that is no longer doesn’t exist anymore. And I cannot put the spectrum, the spectrum in Montreal which is a massive show club bar, huge. And I ended up you know, playing there many times but the way before that I had tried to be like, you know, serving beer and booze to the audience. I was so terrible at it. People would yell at me, like, why can’t you remember my order!  As he was listening to whatever band was playing or what have you are singing songs in my head? Oh, my goodness, I did that. I think I worked in an office. Maybe for a month I ooh, I worked at a store that sold coffee like, and this was in the 80’s. Like, this is like 1980 maybe I don’t know, three or four. I worked selling coffee beans. This is before you know, coffee was a thing. It was back in those days. And we sold all these exotic coffee beans and chocolate. And it was like it was called Cafe Gourmet on Green Avenue in Montreal. And I learned so much there as well about, you know, coffee and stuff like that, which was really interesting. I knew more about that than anybody. So when the whole wave of coffee came in, I was like, yeah, well, I can tell you that espresso has less caffeine, than Tim Hortons’ regular, I’m just saying, , like, I knew all that stuff. And then, oh, gosh, I did a lot of united lots of stuff that I can’t think of right now.

Diane Foy  30:08                                So when you were young, what kind of music were you listen to?

Sass Jordan  30:10

Well, I grew up in Montreal, as I said, so I was listening to you know, when I was young, I wasn’t as discriminatory as I am now. I kind of liked everything. I liked everything. And I was open to a lot more stuff. I think I’m, I’m coming full circle and I’m back to that now. But I went through many years, where I was  like, I’m not listening to that crap, you know, that kind of, you know, so I got what did I not listen to. I listened to show FM, which was the big radio station in the 70’s in Montreal, and they played everything and because it was Montreal, like that’s always been the home of prog rock or, you know, like there was a lot of Genesis and Gentle Giants and Super Tramp and stuff like that. But I mean, that is certainly not all I was listening to. If I you know, we’d be here for the next two years if I gave you the list. And so yeah, I mean, I wanted to be Chaka Khan. That’s what I wanted to be. I used to listen to Rufus featuring Chaka Khan, and I wanted to sing like her more than anything on earth. And how you hear me sang is, now is really sort of a combo of her. Not that I can sing. In no way am I singing it’s a combo of me trying to sound like her with my white ass white girl voice. And all the wonderful, wonderful white male rock singers that I adored, such as Steve Perry, Robin Zander, Steven Tyler, my all time favorite of them all Paul Rodgers from Bad Company, Robert Palmer. Those were the people that the David Bowie. Those are the people I really wanted to sound like I would have loved to have been Ian Anderson from Jethro Tull, but it just wasn’t happening. Just like it wasn’t happening with Chaka Khan. I couldn’t do it to save my life but I tried. And there’s stuff I do tha, you know, came from me trying to sound like her. And I didn’t end up sounding like her. I ended up sounding like me which is good. It’s good. Yeah.

Diane Foy  32:53

So how old were you when you were starting to like sing and and write songs? Get into music?

Sass Jordan  33:00

Well, when I was ten, nine or ten, because we lived in India for a year. When I was eight, I had my ninth birthday. So I have to say this. before the age of nine, or ten, I was had zero exposure to what is called popular music, pop music of any kind because it was the 60’s. I grew up in the 60’s, I was a teenager in the 70’s. Right. And it was a completely different world. My parents are British immigrants and they listened exclusively to classical music. They did not listen to any kind of popular music. Very first song  ever remember hearing, as far as pop music is concerned was a song by 2 O‘clock called “Downtown”. I remember that song. And then, when I, my brother and I one afternoon or in the apartment where we lived. And we would listen. And the radio was on classical music playing as usual. And he and I discovered that you could change the dial. And this whole new world suddenly happened. And the very first song that I ever heard. Aside from that 2 O’clock song was “The Night They Drove Old Dixie Down” by The Band. And I we were transfixed my brother and I were just absolutely couldn’t speak. We were just like, ah, like that. And my mother told me that she had when she came home, she’d been at the grocery store, she’d come home from the groceries. And she said, I came flying towards her. And I said, Mom, Mom, I know what I’m going to do. I know what I want to do. So I would say from the age of, let’s say ten, nine ten, I knew exactly what I was going to do. That’s what I wanted to do. Nothing else interested me. And I mean nothing. I am a high school dropout, I have zero education, so to speak. You know, like in the standard way of it.  I just all I was consumed by music, consumed.

Diane Foy  35:16                                            Wow, from that one song of turning  radio on.

Sass Jordan  35:19

I just knew that’s it. That’s it. And it never, it just went from there. And I always knew I was like, I am going to be somebody that all these people that I love know. They’ve, they’re all going to hear me I’m going to work with them. And I bloody well did every single one of them like, insane. Insane. Yeah, it was like, wow.

Diane Foy  35:47

So how did you do it? Like how, like, did you take any lessons or just taught yourself?

Sass Jordan  35:53

Yes, totally, totally self taught. I tried to take singing lessons, two or three times. When I was in my later teens, I guess I you know what I don’t even remember. And every single time I go, and they would say to me, if you sing the way you sing and continue to sing what you sing, you’re going to lose your voice, you’re never going to be able to sing again. And I was like, oh, yeah? FU. And that was the end of that. And I just I figured it out. And then in the early 2000’s, like 2002, 2002 I was doing this off Broadway show in New York. And it was a Janis, it was a play about Janis Joplin. And I had to sing 19 Janice Shelton songs. And right now, I’ve never been a fan of Janis Joplin. And so I’m particularly a huge fan, but I admire her and respect her now. But I hated her before this show. I didn’t even want to do this show. It was that was the whole that’s a whole other story. Yes, it was an accident. I didn’t think I was going to get the part. For God’s sake. Anyways, I did by accident, and I didn’t want it.

Diane Foy  37:00                                But you can belt like her.

Sass Jordan  37:01

Yeah. And she was had a much higher pitch. But anyways, yeah. And so I was unable to sustain that type of intensity for two and a half hours. And I had to find somebody to show me how to sing in a way that I could do it. And I got hooked up with this extraordinary vocal coach Don Lawrence, who worked with like, Bano and Mick Jagger, and now he’s Lady Gaga’s guy. But that’s and he taught me. He taught me how to sing like, where I did not lose my style or my voice at all. But I learned how to to be able to sustain my my vocal cords, like for five nights in a row or what have you. Yeah, so that was a huge, big deal for me. Now, if I’d had it coach like that, back in the day, it would have been different, you know, but it wasn’t until the early 2000’s that I found somebody.

Diane Foy 38:11                                 Did you ever have a like a vocal scare?

Sass Jordan  38:13                              Oh, God, yes. 100 million times.

Diane Foy  38:14                                Oh, my God. I could lose my voice like that.

Sass Jordan  38:14

I’ve been unable to squeeze a note out. I don’t know how in God’s name. I pulled out some of those shows. I really don’t. But I think that was awesome. I remember one night in San Francisco, I had literally, I could barely talk I sounded like this. He mentioned singing like and my songs. My songs are flipping hard to sing properly. Even I mean, I have trouble when I’m like, for God’s sake, you idiot. Why do you like this crap? Anyways, so I had to do the show. The record company people were there. There are all kinds of people there that I was just like, I don’t I don’t know how many do this. I’m gonna die. I’m gonna die. I’m gonna die. Anyways, I squeaked my way through the show. But I did this intense. I don’t know what I did, Diane, it like acting job. And I swear to you, they all come back after the show. And you’re like, Jesus, I never heard you sing so good in my life, you thought was amazing. I’m like, I couldn’t sing an effing note. Not one note. And I guess it was just the intensity of the energy that I was putting out that they didn’t even notice. Particularly noticed. I’m like, so basically, nobody ever listened to a goddamn note I sang. Clearly I was I was disturbed and yet happy at the same time. Interesting combo of emotions. But yeah, it was the strangest thing. So I’ve had many, many nights, I still have nights where I can’t really sing. You know, but what are you going to do?  The show must go on. So yeah, these people pay money.

Diane Foy  40:02                                What are the tricks? Tea?

Sass Jordan  40:04

No, there’s no trick on Earth, that it will work when your voice is shot, there’s no trick. So what you’ve got to do is got to find. So when you sing a song, you have a muscle map around that song. It’s like muscle memory, you know where your throat and feeling in your voice, throat is going to be when you sing those notes in that song. And you know, I’ve never articulated this before. So this is bear with me. How do I even say that, I don’t know how to say it, because I’ve never thought about it this hard. You just, it’s like a feeling in your throat and diaphragm. It’s fed by your emotion but it has to come through a physical vehicle, which is your body. So  you have the emotion, the emotion is there. Now you have to find a way to get the physical machine to interpret it, I hope I’m not making it sound too ridiculous. But anyways, and there’s a map that you just automatically do it’s like it, it’s like a habit, you know where it goes. And then on if there’s a night where you cannot sing the way you normally do. You have to find other notes and other ways to get the machine to express. I’m making no sense at all. Trying to, okay. So you have to find you have to find a new, you have to find new paths through the song. It’s it’s very, very challenging. And for somebody like me, I don’t tour per se, these days that much. So I don’t generally have a bunch of shows in a row. If I had if I was playing every week, I would be in much better shape,much, because it’s an athlete, you know, your, your voice is athletic. It’s it has it needs to be in shape. I do my I do vocal exercises every day pretty much. You know, I do my 20 minutes every day, which is very helpful but it’s not the same thing as doing an entire show because when you’re doing a show you’re also moving around a lot in my case I move a lot. There’s a lot of intensity and a lot of energy that flows through you. And, you know, your voice has to get back into the into the groove for example, this summer. I have a I have shows every week in August and it’s all over the country. So I got to go for like let’s say Halifax to Vancouver and also flying and not sleeping. Those two things are bad each on their own. But you mix the two together no sleep and flying. That is brutal on a voice brutal you know, but you just got to find a way yes, teas help. And not talking or laughing or having any goddamn fun whatsoever helps.

Diane Foy  43:22

Yeah, I saw that like Celine Dion. She doesn’t actually talk the whole day when she have a show.

Sass Jordan  43:28

See but you know, she’s like a, she’s like a, she’s a like a princess of it. I mean, she you know, I’m not that kind of singer at all. But yeah, but her sing like Celine Dion but Celine Dion can’t sing like me either. So it’s like it’s just a whole different world. Yeah, like if I was her I do this thing.

Diane Foy  43:48  S                                        She’d probably hear you and go no, I’m not singing that.

Sass Jordan  43:50

She sounds like a, you know, like a truck ran through her chords. She’s brilliant. She’s just so different. You know? It’s, it’s what I do is really hard. It’s actually not easy. I had a bunch of people who are in the, you know, like an osteo but my osteopath said to me once. He goes, most people couldn’t last more than five minutes doing what you do, singing how you sing is most people couldn’t do it. Yeah. He says because you’ve been doing it your whole life that you’re still able to do it. It’s extremely intense. Yeah. But, you know, other than that, it’s also a lot of fun. And you get a lot of energy from an audience. That’s what makes it new and interesting every night. because let me tell you, the songs aren’t singing the same damn songs have been singing for the past 20, 30 years. Is it over yet?  It’s like, but it doesn’t feel like that with an audience. When you’re rehearsing,

Diane Foy 45:01                                             Did you feel their energy?

Sass Jordan  45:02                                          Exactly, yes.

Diane Foy  45:09

Like they love that song and they want to hear that song wether you like it or not.

Sass Jordan  45:11

Exactly and that’s really where the joy comes. Because, you know, it’s like, I can’t stand rehearsing.(___________________) And my guitar player goes, yeah, it sucks having a hit, doesn’t it?

Diane Foy  45:27                                Yeah. For you.

Sass Jordan 45:30                               He’s almost right. Let it go. Shut up. You busted your right.

Diane Foy  45:43

What are the songs that you’re kind of like, oh my God, do I got to do this?

Sass Jordan  45:49

Pretty much most of them. You know, I’ve been seeing that. Yeah. In rehearsal, not live. Not live. It’s fine. Yeah. You know, I mean, I’m the songs that you’re known, the songs that I’m known for. I wrote like in, you know, 1989. Or, like, so hard. You know, I that was on my first record that came out in 1989. You know, and then and then all the stuff on Racine came out in 1992 and Rats 1993. Yeah.

You know what I mean it’s like then a hot minute ago. That’s a hot minute ago. But you know, people want to hear the songs they know, Why else would they you know, that’s why they like it. It’s the songs that they grew up or that they miss, you know, and I completely hear that. I mean, I don’t go and see a band I love and not hear one of my songs for God’s sake.

Diane Foy  46:41                                Yeah.

Sass Jordan  46:44

That was my song. I used to listen to that when I was, you know, when I was 10. I mean, god damn it. I want to hear that song.

Diane Foy  46:53

Yeah. So what inspired your songwriting back then? And then what inspires your songwriting now?

Sass Jordan  46:58

So the same thing, it’s always the music itself. So and also human relationships. That’s I’m, I’ll tell you, but I always feel funny saying this, but I think human relationships also human relationships with I’m not going to use that God word, I’m going to use the word doc, which is greater than yourself. Like, what? What the hell are you doing here? A lot of my songs, a lot of them are about my  relationship with a higher being, I don’t know what to say, you know, whatever it is, He created us. Yeah. And, but their disguises like, you know, boy, girl songs are, you know, love songs per se. You know, I think there’s a lot of songs like that a lot, I get the feeling that a lot of that is happening in the you too songs, for example, like a lover that sounds you know, who wants to hear songs about, you know, that. People are more concerned with their relationships with other people, you know, and I, some of my stuff’s about that, for sure. But some of it can. Actually all of it, is it, but you can construe it to in more ways than one. And a lot of times I’ve been inspired more about, you know, like, it’s your relationship with yourself for the part of you that’s greater than your ego, identity.

Diane Foy  48:45

Right and that sometimes what makes a great song is that people, everyone has their different experience with it. And they kind of put a different meaning on it.

Sass Jordan   48.50                             Yeah.

Diane Foy  48: 52                               Which might be completely different than how you knew.

Sass Jordan   48:53

Yeah, I would say that’s always the case. Not sometimes, it’s always the case, except for maybe, you know, relax, don’t do it. Or push pushing the bush. Yeah, those are a little bit less, you know, as a t-rex  show per se. But equally important, in their own way.

Diane Foy   49:31

Were there a couple of your favorite songs that you’ve ever done?

Sass Jordan  49:39                                          That I’ve ever done?

Diane Foy   49:33

Yeah. We’ve talked about what you’re sick of, which is all of them.

Sass Jordan  49:49

That doesn’t sound good, does it? Oh my goodness.Okay, Diane, here’s the thing is they’re involved in my favorites, you know, they’re like to my kids they’re like my children. You know, and, and to this day, I find, you know, amazing things in some of them. It also has a lot of, it’s not only just the audience, it’s also the band and, and the energy with it within our collective as a band, you know, and like, let’s say, somebody plays an insane solo, or a bass player plays like a run that I’m like, Dude, that rocked! You know what I mean, and that happens all the time with my band, the Champagne Hookers. So I named them that, one night, last summer, when we were going to the stage and there was the announcer said, you know, what, how should I introduce the band? And I said, just say saturated in the Champagne Hookers and the band looked at me and we’re like we love that band!  And that was like, okay, well then that’s what we’re going to call you. Anyways. Yeah. I love that name too.

Diane Foy   50:59                                                       And I’m sure there’s a bunch of dudes.

Sass Jordan  51:00                                                      It is actually but it wouldn’t matter.

Diane Foy  51:02

So they’re okay being called that because women would be like, don’t dare call me that.

Sass Jordan  51:07

No any women no, any women that would be in my bed would have a problem with it at all. Everything is see, I am not a very serious.  I don’t like to take myself too seriously or anyone else while we’re at it, you know. Because I mean, you know, you’re going to die. So there’s the bottom line, so get over yourself. Oh, my God, I can go off on a tangent. Sorry, honey.

Diane Foy  51:41

I like tangent, it’s fantastic. So, you had an album, I guess last year where you re-did your own songs?

Sass Jordan  51:50

Yeah, yeah. Yeah, that was fun. It was just because we needed to do something to celebrate the 25th anniversary, and it was like, I don’t want to do a re-master or, you know, the kind of usual kind of stuff. And so, Peter, my manager said, listen, why don’t we just re-record it, like, why don’t we just, you know, because the thing is, is that the songs themselves, that record was written in 1991, and was released in 1992. You know, like, a lot of it was written in ‘91. And so over the years, the songs have grown and matured to being played continuously live, you know. So, when you do a song live, you have to sometimes adapt it to that context to a live context, you can’t do the same thing you did on a recording. So some of them have morphed into versions that I far prefer and they just work better, and they sound better. And that is what we did on the re-recording, on the Racine Revisited. Some of them aren’t pretty much the exact same. And some of them are, you know, the live versions that we’ve been doing for years now. And so it’s different. It’s, it’s the same enough to not make you go, Oh, this isn’t like the record I love, you know, but it’s different enough and make you go, Okay, I want to own that one, too. Because this is like really cool. Like it’s a different, you know, different versions. Not that different, but different enough. And so yeah, that was a real blast, and also getting to record it all together, the band all together, we all live together at the studio outside of Calgary, in Alberta. And, you know, we just work from morning till night, all together, all together now, which is how I would like to, that’s how ideally, I would like to record everything I ever do. But time, money, schedules, etc, does not generally permit that to happen. You know, so it was a real treat to get to do it that way, which is how I would have liked to have done the original version. You know, the original recording, it was not that far off. I mean, we worked at one book about three different Studios in Los Angeles when we were recording Racine the original, you know, but I wanted to do it as if we were in the 70’s and all living, you know, living together in a ranch, you know, like the Bonnie Raitt records. Exactly. And so we did, and it’s wonderful. And I love the way it turned out. But that’s why I did it. It was because it was the 25th anniversary of horrors.

Diane Foy  54:38

Did any songs hit strike you as a new inspiration for you? Do they mean something different to you now than they did then?

Sass Jordan  54:55

Sorry, long pause while I think about that, never thought about it. Not really, not really.

Yeah. Yeah. Weird. Wow. I really have to think about that more. But you know, I pretty much I can’t think of anything, nothing stands out to me. Let’s say that. Yeah.

Diane Foy  55:19

So you’ve done some acting. Is that was that was just a period of time where you were into it?

Sass Jordan  55:27

I’m not into acting, per se. I’m not an actor, per se. But you know, the reason I did it was because I was asked to do it. And I thought, wow that’d be fun I’ve never done that. And so I will always do it. If it sounds fun. Anything you say, you asked me to do that sounds fun. And I’m the time or you’re offering me a lot of money. I’ll do it. I’ll do it. Yeah, exactly. It’s God’s and that is how all of those things happen. Like I did this television show which was a huge show in the early 90’s. It was like a nighttime soap kind of thing. It was called Sisters. It was called sisters. And I had auditioned to do it, the audition to 200 people to do it. And I had no experience had no idea what the hell I was doing. I didn’t like have a clue at all, like zero. And I’m like, why did you guys pick me? Like, why the hell did you pick me I was like, and they said, it was really interesting to me what they said, they go, this is television and you know, it’s not like you’re going to be they said, it’s an energy. That’s what they said, Listen, we can we can coach you through every line and solve all your problem. And we can tell you where to stand and how to work. You know, all that stuff. That’s not going to be a problem. It’s the energy that comes through the camera. That’s what we were looking for. And that’s why we picked you. Isn’t that interesting? I was like, wow, but then all the actors on the show say a word and she said to me you know, you really could be an actress if you wanted to, you know, you could I’ll get you in touch with my coach. And you know, because you’re probably good like this is like your natural at this. And I’m like, no, thanks. Way too hard.  Thank you know, backs. I’m going to stick with the same game. That’s hard enough. Bye. Bye. And so I say hard. But you know, it was like, didn’t make any sense. Cool. And I auditioned, I auditioned for, do you remember that movie franchise called Die Hard with Bruce Willis?

Diane Foy  57:58

Never seen them, I’m one of those people. Never saw it.  I’m one of those people never thought you’ve heard of them. I’ve definitely heard of them.I usually shock people when I say I’ve never saw that, and they’re like, what?

Sass Jordan  58:08


I’m exact same. I’ve never seen a single one of them and I never will. But I auditioned, they flew me from Vegas to New York to audition for one of them. I don’t know which one, which, whatever. Anyways, it was already a huge franchise. And I had to meet with the director. They want it so that the part that they had wanted me to audition for was the part of a terrorist, some kind of Russian terrorist or something. I didn’t have to say a word. There was no dialogue. But you know.

Diane Foy   58:44

I’m trying to picture you as a Russian terrorist. I just picture you laughing.

Sass Jordan  58:52

If you were an actor, maybe you could do it. But I’m not I’m just saying.  Anyway, they flew me out from L.A. and I was like, okay, before is me and my boyfriend is there any problem? Sure, no problem. I said first class? And said no problem. And I need a nice hotel. No problem. I’m like, dude, I’m in. So they do this did they take me to the sets, no or wherever, I don’t know, where the hell to go meet with the director. And I cannot figure out for the life of me. Why everybody’s creeping around and talking in whispers and they’re like, you know, this guy’s like, you know, Jesus Christ on the set this director, but to me, because I don’t come from this world. I have no idea who he is. Nor do I care. Right. And he’s just a dude. He’s a guy, whatever. Yeah. Which precisely is exactly what he is. But because everybody who’s working on it, you know, like, depending on him for their job, it could I mean, I get it, I get it. I understand why everybody was in complete, like, you don’t  want to upset the guy or whatever. But I’m like, anyway, I go in and meet this guy. It looks like a, you know, ordinary guy to me and, and I said, listen, before we get started, I just want to say this. Do I have to die on screen in this movie? And the guy goes, he’s like looking at me like, who the hell is this chic? And he goes, yeah. And I went, Okay, I don’t want to do it. I’m not doing that. I that creeps me out. I said, that’s just too weird. I can’t do that. What an arrogant little south. But I had no idea. I wasn’t doing it to be arrogant. I was just, it just horrified me the thought that I have to watch myself dying on the screen. If this happened now, I would have no problem with it. I’m just saying. But at that time it gross. I was like, I don’t know. I can’t do that. And he’s just like the whole place was looking at me like are you out of your cotton pickin’ skull? Oh, my goodness, gracious. Needless to say,  I didn’t get the part. But I also didn’t want it. I was like, free trip to New York. Anyway, yeah. I mean, that’s the kind of weird, silly business I’ve been involved in in my life. Seriously, what a turkey.

Diane Foy  1:01:18                                         Is there anything that you haven’t done that you still want to do?

Sass Jordan  1:01:26

Oh, my God, that we’d be here till the middle of forever. If I was to list to you, the things I want to do that I haven’t done.

Diane Foy  1:01:37


I’m like you. I’m like, there’s a million things. And it’ll be a different thing tomorrow and more new things.

Sass Jordan  1:01:42

Yes,oh no. You and I are definitely on the same page. And I’ll never, ever have enough time in this lifetime. To do all the things that I want to do. I just have to keep prioritizing every day. And the priorities change because something else happens. And it’s something else, you know what I mean, this is endlessly fascinating to me. I love it.

Diane Foy  1:02:05

I’m learning prioritizing now too, because like, when you do have the interests and things, I can go in a million different directions and forget what I was supposed to be doing.

Sass Jordan 1:02:17                            Yeah, what is your birthday?

Diane Foy  1:02:18                                         I’m a Sagittarius December 5th.

Sass Jordan  1:02:22

Okay, stop right there. It’s the five. You see the fifth right there. It’s your five. You’re born on a five day no wonder you’re like that. Guess what? I am also born on a five day 23 is a five day so that is that’s it. It’s obvious that we are fascinated by everything. Anything.

Diane Foy  1:02:42                                         What month? What month?

Sass Jordan  1:02:44

December 23. Yeah, but that is five days as well. It’s Capricorn but I have Sagittarius rising. So you know, yeah.

Diane Foy  1:03:00                                         I see some similarities with us.

Sass Jordan 1:03:03                                        Yeah baby, for sure.

Diane Foy  1:03:05                                         Do you want to do this? Yes, sure. Let’s do it.

Sass Jordan  1:03:06                           Is it, does it sound fun? I’m in.

Diane Foy  1:03:08                                         Sounds good. Yeah.

Sass Jordan  1:03:08

That’s my mandate. Have fun in life. Period. Because you’re not getting out alive. That’s it.

Diane Foy  1:03:22                                         It is very fun talking to you

Sass Jordan  1:03:26                           Thank you. I’m so glad. Yay!

Diane Foy 1:03:30                                          Where can people find you online?

Sass Jordan  1:03:26                                       Just my name sassjordan. com.

Diane Foy  1:03:35                                         So, the one question I ask everyone is what is your why?

Sass Jordan  1:03:39

My why? Well see I will answer that very, very eloquently. If I had the faintest fucking idea what you’re talking about. I don’t know what you mean. My why?

Diane Foy  1:03:54

I did an episode for people like you. I did an episode, all about finding your why.

Sass Jordan   1:03:55                          You mean the letter y?

Diane Foy  1:03:56                                         Some people know, some people have no clue.

Sass Jordan  1:03:56                                       I have no clue. Is it the reason to be?

Diane Foy  1:04:09

Yeah, like, What? Why do you do what you do? What motivates you to keep continue doing it?

Sass Jordan 1:04:17

I think I’ve answered that about 18 times already in the podcast, which is, there’s two words for that. And one is fun, and the other is love.  Everything is nearly transit to me that it’s like fun and love joy. That’s the only reason I do anything. Anything, anything. That’s the only reason I’m alive. Love and joy and laughter fun, fun. And for to me. Laughter falls under fun, as does music as this you know, and I mean, all these things are just the glorious gifts life is such so much fun. Yes, it’s challenging and difficult and all those things. But you know, when you look back on those things, you go wow, usually, you know, I’m glad that happened. I’m glad I I lived through it. Because you wouldn’t be looking back on them if you didn’t live through it. Would you agree? Yeah. So yeah, yeah. Inspiring other people also, I mean, that’s such a huge big hairy ass deal for me. I love that. I love that. But all that I do is geared in that way anyway, like I always that’s that’s my motive. I don’t like the word motivation makes it sound so, that’s another there’s my why yeah. To inspire others to have fun doing it.

Diane Foy 1:05:40

And you want your music to inspire others. You want your wine to inspire others.

Sass Jordan  1:05:45

I want my existence  but to inspire others Yeah. And I don’t care what happens on someday I could give to you know what I don’t care I don’t care if my name last one second longer than I do. I just don’t care Yeah, I’d so irrelevant to me. I’m not interested in a legacy or legend or any I could share last year because I’m not going to be here to you know reap the benefits of that. So who is it?

Diane Foy  1:06:15                                         Yeah, are you a living in the moment 100%?

Sass Jordan  1:06:17                           A hundred thousand percent. Yeah, yeah.

Diane Foy 1:06:21                                          Oh, so much fun talking to you. Thank you so much.

Sass Jordan 1:06:25

Okay, my darling. Well, this is awesome. And thank you so much for your patience. You are absolutely wonderful.